DeletedUser
Guest
There are a few reasons why this has been put here. One is that often players on the world decide to keep information to themselves, in the old slogan of information is power. This has a negative effect on a world. So here I am, telling the story of EXP. Part of that is my second reason for posting here. I believe the members of EXP to have suffered an injustice, an injustice they have to get on with. An injustice, I think should be more widely known. My last reason, is this is some story, it was a pleasure to experience and will be to write. This is a long piece, but I have put in a load of spoilers to make things easier to read. There is also a summary at the bottom of the post.
The story starts with the W1N/CHE!!! merge. As can be seen on the forums, where I offered no strong opposition or opposition of any kind to it, it was obvious my approval was nowhere to be found (not that it needed to be). That being so, my account was not being invited into W1N, so I was bored and quit the account.
Now at this point, some would say, you are nothing to the world, leave it. I had no motives of any revenge, no desire to bring anyone down, and no loyalties to anyone other than friends. But still, fun was to be had in the world, so fun I wanted. I decided this fun would be in EXP. Contacting a contact, who shall be named unknown, I spoke to him about EXP. After a while, I fed him the idea very slowly, of me joining EXP. However, instead of then asking for an account in EXP, I persuaded him that I would be in the best position on the negotiation table, as it were, if Vikki came to me asking me to join. The contact persuaded vikki, and during a group conversation, I agreed to take up an account with the conditions of baronship and diplomat for EXP. Having learned that Vikki had several times threatened to quit from Leadership from another source, I knew it would only be a matter of time for an opportunity of a takeover if I wanted to be leader. Though I was undecided on that one.
Not long later, the next day even, Warpedthunder and four other barons (known to me but will not be named for certain reasons) voted Vikki out, with Warped taking over. However, they were very clumsy. They intentionally excluded some from voting (which Vikki even obtained a quote of) and they way in which they overthrew her was rushed and set Vikki against those who she knew were involved. Vikki also had control of hers and horsychen's account, both of which were the only dukes. Therefore, they had to approach her directly to get her to stand down. Lukcily for them, she did, and gave them duke.
Below is the takeover mail from Warped.
However, following that, just a couple of hours or so later Vikki slammed the decision to replace her on the forum and ranted on how she had been victim of a coup. Some were asking, why did she give up dukeship? However, a very large amount got angry at the leadership and Vikki had quite some following. She came to me on skype asking if I would also leave with her when she did, to form her own tribe. I told her it was madness, and that she would split up the tribe and cause irriversable damage on the tribe, the war effort and a number of players. She was hurt, angry, even enraged. Below is the interesting conversation between myself and Vikki on the same day.
First thing you will notice, is that there was the avoided point that she demoted herself. Obviously, at the time, she decided she would not lead and demoted herself. Later regretting this however, she as seen took this course of action. The second thing that can be noticed is there was a large attempt to take as many as she could. She wanted everyone but those involved in replacing her.
Disagreeing already with what was happening, during a conversation with Warped I wrote him a quick circular to write to the tribe to try to salvage his position. It is important to note, he did not know who I was, but seeing the sense in the strategy, agreed and sent it to the tribe.
As you can see, the tone is largely apologetic in the middle. The strategy being to mild the situation, and stop any split, with talks with Vikki.
However, unfortunately due to Warped being away for a while, Vikki sent this mail just a few minutes before also:
I spoke to vikki once again, telling her to look at the tone and content of what Warped had written. The conversation is below:
She did not respond after that. Still annoyed and angry, she split off the tribe, taking what she could with her. I asked her to join again, teling her a vote would be won by her. Each time she refused, now in love with her own creation. This can be illustrated below. It also shows something I was quite disgusted by.
You may have not seen it, since I am sure many gloss over it. But to emphasize with what was said on a EXP chat by a Vikki supporter:
A claim that Vikki had only been mailed, did not mail anyone. A claim Vikki made to me in the skype convo above when she said "i'mm only sending out invites on request". However, this is totally disproved in the same conversation, where she asked me to join and said she had 20 already confirmed. It's an incredible lie. One that was made to make it look like she did not have to rally for support. With no major opposition it was an easy lie to get away with, but a hugely destructive one. She did not leave and have some people go hey can I join you in that one personed ambitionless tribe, rather she wanted revenge, a mark of her own.
Though this is not a rant at Vikki. But I think the conversations above can show you that it was quite remarkable what happened. I have misplaced the mail, but it is in very similar terms to the Doozy leaving and making FPB that she rallied against. He declared on CHE!!! in a circular, claiming it his last act as leader. Destructive and irrisponsible. A move that damaged EXP a huge amount. Vikki had now done a very similar action, also damaging the tribe.
I was reminded of the comparatively subtle argument with Adellion on the other thread about the merits of following loyalty and of thinking for yourself. But this had hit a whole new chapter. These leaders believed they deserved loyalty. I kept thinking the same question.
When did leaders start believing they were there to be served instead of knowing they were there to serve??
The EXP account I had, had no support, and although Vikki assured me that it was because it had just come out of bunnies, I still wondered why it didn't have support before that. Whilst others said this was not uncommon. (Edit: Evidence has been given to this, but sensitive information means editing it out).
From the start, EXP had no organisation, co-ordination was useless, with the only thing I saw was bragging about old co-ordination.
But onto now on the next part of the story. Players were leaving all over the place. FIRE gained a huge amount, and some went to FPB. EXP was in complete disarray and Warped knew that whatever it was they had planned, it had failed, totally failed. By now Warped had made me baron, so that I could clear a few areas of the forum up, which was a complete mess, so that I could start clamping down on the hate talk, and clear up a few loose ends :icon_wink: One idea that had quickly gained momentum was that an election should be held. For the tribe to decide who should lead next. However, things were looking like there wouldn't even be enough time. I told Warped finally who my old account was, and told him to make me interim Duke whilst elections went on. To steer the boat through the storm. Warped convinced the council to make me duke, and so it was, me, Iain666, was duke :icon_wink:
I got to work, clearing things up, talking to other tribes, and making sure to talk to enough, get some reassurances on temporarily staying, to get enough support for people to stay long enough. I started bringing EXT into EXP to beefen up the numbers, since there was now space enough for just one tribe also.
Talks with other tribes were mostly uninteresting. Fire were being stubborn, Doozy was being communicative in respect to helping us co-ordinating, effectively trying to help each other, but ruling any possibility out of returning, despite Vikki having left. He also seemingly had grown attached to his new tribe. Interesting phsycological lessons for any who are keen enough to spot them.
However, there was quite some talk with T4H that was amusing. First of all, the original talks that led to T4H vs. EXP.
Now, having been given the talks that led to EXP vs T4H, I can say the actions of anyone even in the council of EXP should be questioned. This was such an abusive, aggressive, and reckless move by them to take in TEA. I do not know who was the main driving force behind it, but critisize anyone who stood for it I must. Yet more leadership failings in EXP.
But the T4H talks... well I can say unless they change tune any time soon T4H and EXP are staying at war for some time. But what must be noted was the power grab at which T4H tried to reach. They offered a merge of the whole of EXP. Telling them they could move into the 4 tribes of T4H. That FW would stop the war, with some inactives compensation, and that W1N would stop using the friendship they had with them and the inactive compensation, added to active players giving 5-10 villages each. Leading to this glorious quote:
And so we come to the end of this story. There are tiny details I have left out, but the majority of the story is here. The vote in EXP went onto be a one horse race, as the new leader made an excellent speech, which no-one else opposed with their own.
Whilst for myself, maybe it's time for something new :icon_wink: I also have a W47 tribe I really should be leading right now... :icon_wink: But I shall end with a few summary points:
- Yes this did happen in under a week. Yes I did become EXP leader, the at the time rank 2 tribe, in just two days. Thank you for those who have managed to call me amazing, God, a master of subterfuge (cheers Timmy :icon_wink
and tell me I suck all within around 3 days. Though really, I didn't actually write this for myself, but for those in EXP. So no comments on that.
- There were remarkable failings by the old EXP leadership. Both Doozy and Vikki seemed to lead for themselves. They both had less regard for the actual players in EXP, and the players in EXP have been very hard done by.
- Some players in EXP should be commended for their loyalty and efforts. Instead, they are rewarded with downward looks, jibes and their old leaders who have done them wrong getting away with it. On other threads some of these leaders even look like angels. This is wrong.
- T4H offered to merge EXP. An interesting development. Whilst T4H seemed badly led and disorganised.
- EXP is still very much active, with a new elected duke.
- What will happen? It is likely Fire will fall at some point. At the moment it will continue to do very well in its honey moon period. EXP will likely go on for a while, but unfortunately, despite some players actions being commendable, I believe they will stumble. F.P.B, however, I believe will go from strength to strength. Critical I have been of Doozy in this thread, and he does have large flaws. But he is a strong leader with a steady grip on things from what has been seen. I can see F.P.B becoming a light version of EXP/EXT. Though ultimately, the role they will have on this world will be small. The centerpiece of the world that is W1N, will likely not see any threat for some time from this side of the world, leaving TR, Flux and Orc the main components in a possible world war against W1N. Though what any of these tribe's status' are are largely speculative.
Hope you enjoyed the read :icon_wink:
Bye bye
Blue :icon_wink:
The story starts with the W1N/CHE!!! merge. As can be seen on the forums, where I offered no strong opposition or opposition of any kind to it, it was obvious my approval was nowhere to be found (not that it needed to be). That being so, my account was not being invited into W1N, so I was bored and quit the account.
Now at this point, some would say, you are nothing to the world, leave it. I had no motives of any revenge, no desire to bring anyone down, and no loyalties to anyone other than friends. But still, fun was to be had in the world, so fun I wanted. I decided this fun would be in EXP. Contacting a contact, who shall be named unknown, I spoke to him about EXP. After a while, I fed him the idea very slowly, of me joining EXP. However, instead of then asking for an account in EXP, I persuaded him that I would be in the best position on the negotiation table, as it were, if Vikki came to me asking me to join. The contact persuaded vikki, and during a group conversation, I agreed to take up an account with the conditions of baronship and diplomat for EXP. Having learned that Vikki had several times threatened to quit from Leadership from another source, I knew it would only be a matter of time for an opportunity of a takeover if I wanted to be leader. Though I was undecided on that one.
Not long later, the next day even, Warpedthunder and four other barons (known to me but will not be named for certain reasons) voted Vikki out, with Warped taking over. However, they were very clumsy. They intentionally excluded some from voting (which Vikki even obtained a quote of) and they way in which they overthrew her was rushed and set Vikki against those who she knew were involved. Vikki also had control of hers and horsychen's account, both of which were the only dukes. Therefore, they had to approach her directly to get her to stand down. Lukcily for them, she did, and gave them duke.
Below is the takeover mail from Warped.
warpedthunder on 28.04. at 10:33
I placed this note in the Tribal News Area, but I am aware that not everyone is Forum Active, you know who you are!! So, I am sending this to the full tribe.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
You will have read by now that [player]Vikki Venom[/player] stepped down in the early hours of this morning. Nobody is more sad than myself that it has come to this. Vikki has been an amazing servant for EXP long before I was around.
This all happened after some intense discussion within the whole of World 1. 5 Members of the Council met and the consensus was that we needed a new direction, and so we made this request to ask Vikki to step back from the top job. Nobody removed her rights, Vikki did the decent thing, which shows her character. Nobody wanted her to leave the tribe, she is an excellent attacking player and a damned good person aswell. Vikki is currently still in EXP, and I sincerely hope it stays that way.
We are well aware that many won't be happy with what has happened, and that may include some in the council who were not available at the time, but we have to act quickly and decisively to ensure our long term survival. We are being attacked from all sides and there is feverish activity in the Diplomatic Circles around W1 as W1N threaten to overtake everyone.
A new Council will be put together quickly and new K and War Roles will be created. If anyone is interested in taking the step up, please mail me asap.
[player]WarpedThunder[/player]
Duke
I placed this note in the Tribal News Area, but I am aware that not everyone is Forum Active, you know who you are!! So, I am sending this to the full tribe.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
You will have read by now that [player]Vikki Venom[/player] stepped down in the early hours of this morning. Nobody is more sad than myself that it has come to this. Vikki has been an amazing servant for EXP long before I was around.
This all happened after some intense discussion within the whole of World 1. 5 Members of the Council met and the consensus was that we needed a new direction, and so we made this request to ask Vikki to step back from the top job. Nobody removed her rights, Vikki did the decent thing, which shows her character. Nobody wanted her to leave the tribe, she is an excellent attacking player and a damned good person aswell. Vikki is currently still in EXP, and I sincerely hope it stays that way.
We are well aware that many won't be happy with what has happened, and that may include some in the council who were not available at the time, but we have to act quickly and decisively to ensure our long term survival. We are being attacked from all sides and there is feverish activity in the Diplomatic Circles around W1 as W1N threaten to overtake everyone.
A new Council will be put together quickly and new K and War Roles will be created. If anyone is interested in taking the step up, please mail me asap.
[player]WarpedThunder[/player]
Duke
However, following that, just a couple of hours or so later Vikki slammed the decision to replace her on the forum and ranted on how she had been victim of a coup. Some were asking, why did she give up dukeship? However, a very large amount got angry at the leadership and Vikki had quite some following. She came to me on skype asking if I would also leave with her when she did, to form her own tribe. I told her it was madness, and that she would split up the tribe and cause irriversable damage on the tribe, the war effort and a number of players. She was hurt, angry, even enraged. Below is the interesting conversation between myself and Vikki on the same day.
[28/04/2010 11:31:28] Vikki Venom: hi are you there?
[28/04/2010 13:21:16] Rob: hey
[28/04/2010 13:21:17] Rob: i am
[28/04/2010 13:21:18] Rob:
[28/04/2010 13:21:34] Vikki Venom: ok
[28/04/2010 13:21:41] Vikki Venom: as you know things happened last night
[28/04/2010 13:21:51] Vikki Venom: i'm about to leave EXP and make a new tribe
[28/04/2010 13:22:02] Vikki Venom: i know a lot of exp are coming with me
[28/04/2010 13:22:05] Vikki Venom: are u in?
[28/04/2010 13:22:26] Vikki Venom: there was no majority council vote
[28/04/2010 13:22:54] Rob: to do this will only harm EXPs chances more...
[28/04/2010 13:23:03] Vikki Venom: well
[28/04/2010 13:23:06] Vikki Venom: it won't
[28/04/2010 13:23:14] Vikki Venom: because 90% are coming with me
[28/04/2010 13:23:30] Vikki Venom:
[28/04/2010 13:23:37] Vikki Venom: management has lied again
[28/04/2010 13:23:49] Vikki Venom: the discussions are on in the exp room right now
[28/04/2010 13:23:58] Vikki Venom: one thing ppl know about me
[28/04/2010 13:23:59] Rob: and those who dont will either be left to die or go to fpb
[28/04/2010 13:24:04] Vikki Venom: i'm true to my word
[28/04/2010 13:24:14] Vikki Venom: thats why they are coming
[28/04/2010 13:24:49] Rob: is this the only solution?
[28/04/2010 13:24:58] Vikki Venom: yep
[28/04/2010 13:25:04] Rob: why did you not hold out for a majority council vote
[28/04/2010 13:25:33] Vikki Venom: because they wanted me all the 4 council voter out, no one else was asked
[28/04/2010 13:25:57] Rob: then u shud have constructed a proper confidence vote surely?
[28/04/2010 13:26:09] Vikki Venom: as for the rest of the council im sorry but we knew you were too close too vikki to include you in any discussions
[28/04/2010 13:26:21] Vikki Venom: that was ran al thor last night
[28/04/2010 13:26:32] Rob: then why did you not wait and do your own vote
[28/04/2010 13:26:33] Vikki Venom: and this is precisely why a fresh start is needed
[28/04/2010 13:26:35] Rob: werent you duke
[28/04/2010 13:26:44] Vikki Venom: because i was told to demote myself
[28/04/2010 13:26:54] Rob: you didnt have to
[28/04/2010 13:26:59] Vikki Venom: they demoted chen as well which isn't good at all
[28/04/2010 13:30:41] Rob: im just very concerned
[28/04/2010 13:30:48] Vikki Venom: don't be
[28/04/2010 13:30:58] Vikki Venom: i have all but about 4 ppls backing here
[28/04/2010 13:31:13] Rob: all being how many?
[28/04/2010 13:31:24] Vikki Venom: i have 4/5 ks coming with me
[28/04/2010 13:31:29] Vikki Venom: the rest will follow
[28/04/2010 13:31:33] Rob: solid numbers
[28/04/2010 13:31:35] Rob: how many people
[28/04/2010 13:31:49] Vikki Venom: i have the back of K55/56
[28/04/2010 13:31:54] Vikki Venom: K67
[28/04/2010 13:32:07] Vikki Venom: proably the whole of the north members
[28/04/2010 13:32:22] Rob: how many
[28/04/2010 13:32:25] Rob: have said they will
[28/04/2010 13:32:47] Vikki Venom: about 20 so far
[28/04/2010 13:32:59] Vikki Venom: more will foloow as they come online
[28/04/2010 13:33:19] Vikki Venom: everyone is sick of the backstabbing which won't happen once its started afresh
[28/04/2010 13:33:32] Vikki Venom: everyone who comes knows they can depend on each other
[28/04/2010 13:34:13] Rob: if this happens there is no chance of fpb reconciliation
[28/04/2010 13:34:45] Vikki Venom: it's already happening
[28/04/2010 13:34:50] Rob: how so?
[28/04/2010 13:34:56] Rob: broken wing and doozy wouldnt agree to it
[28/04/2010 13:35:00] Vikki Venom: i'm not being stabbed in the back twice
[28/04/2010 13:35:29] Vikki Venom: they only left because they made a huge mess of things
[28/04/2010 13:35:45] Vikki Venom: and the tribe lost interest with doozy being duke
[28/04/2010 13:38:24] Rob: so they will come back?#
[28/04/2010 13:39:10] Vikki Venom: some of the 'rabbits may join the new tribe
[28/04/2010 13:44:09] Rob: this will create irriversable damage
[28/04/2010 13:45:34] Rob: it is the wrong decision
[28/04/2010 13:45:38] Rob: however i did pledge to help you
[28/04/2010 13:46:44] Rob: so yours I am
[28/04/2010 13:47:04] Vikki Venom: we'll be fine
[28/04/2010 13:47:19] Vikki Venom: and i can probably get the FW nap too
[28/04/2010 13:47:43] Rob: mm
[28/04/2010 13:48:20 | Edited 13:48:34] Vikki Venom: just need a good team of dedicated players and no bloody backstabbing
[28/04/2010 14:05:13] Rob: backstabbing doesnt happen without cause though
[28/04/2010 14:05:22] Rob: i did say u needed to cement your position
[28/04/2010 14:05:39] Vikki Venom: this will happen with the new tribe
[28/04/2010 14:05:52] Vikki Venom: everyone who comes over will 100% behind me
[28/04/2010 14:06:01] Vikki Venom: just need to write amail
[28/04/2010 13:21:16] Rob: hey
[28/04/2010 13:21:17] Rob: i am
[28/04/2010 13:21:18] Rob:
[28/04/2010 13:21:34] Vikki Venom: ok
[28/04/2010 13:21:41] Vikki Venom: as you know things happened last night
[28/04/2010 13:21:51] Vikki Venom: i'm about to leave EXP and make a new tribe
[28/04/2010 13:22:02] Vikki Venom: i know a lot of exp are coming with me
[28/04/2010 13:22:05] Vikki Venom: are u in?
[28/04/2010 13:22:26] Vikki Venom: there was no majority council vote
[28/04/2010 13:22:54] Rob: to do this will only harm EXPs chances more...
[28/04/2010 13:23:03] Vikki Venom: well
[28/04/2010 13:23:06] Vikki Venom: it won't
[28/04/2010 13:23:14] Vikki Venom: because 90% are coming with me
[28/04/2010 13:23:30] Vikki Venom:
[28/04/2010 13:23:37] Vikki Venom: management has lied again
[28/04/2010 13:23:49] Vikki Venom: the discussions are on in the exp room right now
[28/04/2010 13:23:58] Vikki Venom: one thing ppl know about me
[28/04/2010 13:23:59] Rob: and those who dont will either be left to die or go to fpb
[28/04/2010 13:24:04] Vikki Venom: i'm true to my word
[28/04/2010 13:24:14] Vikki Venom: thats why they are coming
[28/04/2010 13:24:49] Rob: is this the only solution?
[28/04/2010 13:24:58] Vikki Venom: yep
[28/04/2010 13:25:04] Rob: why did you not hold out for a majority council vote
[28/04/2010 13:25:33] Vikki Venom: because they wanted me all the 4 council voter out, no one else was asked
[28/04/2010 13:25:57] Rob: then u shud have constructed a proper confidence vote surely?
[28/04/2010 13:26:09] Vikki Venom: as for the rest of the council im sorry but we knew you were too close too vikki to include you in any discussions
[28/04/2010 13:26:21] Vikki Venom: that was ran al thor last night
[28/04/2010 13:26:32] Rob: then why did you not wait and do your own vote
[28/04/2010 13:26:33] Vikki Venom: and this is precisely why a fresh start is needed
[28/04/2010 13:26:35] Rob: werent you duke
[28/04/2010 13:26:44] Vikki Venom: because i was told to demote myself
[28/04/2010 13:26:54] Rob: you didnt have to
[28/04/2010 13:26:59] Vikki Venom: they demoted chen as well which isn't good at all
[28/04/2010 13:30:41] Rob: im just very concerned
[28/04/2010 13:30:48] Vikki Venom: don't be
[28/04/2010 13:30:58] Vikki Venom: i have all but about 4 ppls backing here
[28/04/2010 13:31:13] Rob: all being how many?
[28/04/2010 13:31:24] Vikki Venom: i have 4/5 ks coming with me
[28/04/2010 13:31:29] Vikki Venom: the rest will follow
[28/04/2010 13:31:33] Rob: solid numbers
[28/04/2010 13:31:35] Rob: how many people
[28/04/2010 13:31:49] Vikki Venom: i have the back of K55/56
[28/04/2010 13:31:54] Vikki Venom: K67
[28/04/2010 13:32:07] Vikki Venom: proably the whole of the north members
[28/04/2010 13:32:22] Rob: how many
[28/04/2010 13:32:25] Rob: have said they will
[28/04/2010 13:32:47] Vikki Venom: about 20 so far
[28/04/2010 13:32:59] Vikki Venom: more will foloow as they come online
[28/04/2010 13:33:19] Vikki Venom: everyone is sick of the backstabbing which won't happen once its started afresh
[28/04/2010 13:33:32] Vikki Venom: everyone who comes knows they can depend on each other
[28/04/2010 13:34:13] Rob: if this happens there is no chance of fpb reconciliation
[28/04/2010 13:34:45] Vikki Venom: it's already happening
[28/04/2010 13:34:50] Rob: how so?
[28/04/2010 13:34:56] Rob: broken wing and doozy wouldnt agree to it
[28/04/2010 13:35:00] Vikki Venom: i'm not being stabbed in the back twice
[28/04/2010 13:35:29] Vikki Venom: they only left because they made a huge mess of things
[28/04/2010 13:35:45] Vikki Venom: and the tribe lost interest with doozy being duke
[28/04/2010 13:38:24] Rob: so they will come back?#
[28/04/2010 13:39:10] Vikki Venom: some of the 'rabbits may join the new tribe
[28/04/2010 13:44:09] Rob: this will create irriversable damage
[28/04/2010 13:45:34] Rob: it is the wrong decision
[28/04/2010 13:45:38] Rob: however i did pledge to help you
[28/04/2010 13:46:44] Rob: so yours I am
[28/04/2010 13:47:04] Vikki Venom:
we'll be fine[28/04/2010 13:47:19] Vikki Venom: and i can probably get the FW nap too
[28/04/2010 13:47:43] Rob: mm
[28/04/2010 13:48:20 | Edited 13:48:34] Vikki Venom: just need a good team of dedicated players and no bloody backstabbing
[28/04/2010 14:05:13] Rob: backstabbing doesnt happen without cause though
[28/04/2010 14:05:22] Rob: i did say u needed to cement your position
[28/04/2010 14:05:39] Vikki Venom: this will happen with the new tribe
[28/04/2010 14:05:52] Vikki Venom: everyone who comes over will 100% behind me
[28/04/2010 14:06:01] Vikki Venom: just need to write amail
First thing you will notice, is that there was the avoided point that she demoted herself. Obviously, at the time, she decided she would not lead and demoted herself. Later regretting this however, she as seen took this course of action. The second thing that can be noticed is there was a large attempt to take as many as she could. She wanted everyone but those involved in replacing her.
Disagreeing already with what was happening, during a conversation with Warped I wrote him a quick circular to write to the tribe to try to salvage his position. It is important to note, he did not know who I was, but seeing the sense in the strategy, agreed and sent it to the tribe.
warpedthunder on 28.04. at 14:38
EXP, we are on the brink of ruin. Internal disputes between leaders have gone on for months. Our enemies close in on us, and our old allies join them. Our once great empire had resorted onto infighting and power struggles. The first of our fallout was [ally]F.P.B[/ally]. A struggle between [player]Vikki Venom[/player] and [player]Doozy[/player] for tribe leadership. The fallout from that dispute has hurt us much. Still more leave us, dissatisfied with the fractured [ally]EXP[/ally].
Yesterday, myself and a number of others on the council thought it best, that the solution to this, was for us to take charge so that we can unite the tribe and bring back F.P.B into the fold. To make our tribe great again. But I see we were wrong. I was wrong. What was meant to be a way of saving us, has only threatened to split us more. At this point, as many of you know, [player]Vikki Venom[/player] seeks to make a new tribe. To split away from the tribe and start a fresh. It hurts to know that I have caused this, as I only ever took actions that were to be for the best of the tribe.
But it is not me, nor Vikki, nor Doozy who will solve these problems of ours. It is you. So caught up have we been in an eternal power struggle, we have forgotten who really controls a tribe, forgotten who we are. The last thing I want is to split this tribe up more. All I want is to unite it. But I cannot do that alone. You the members have to grasp the impossible from the jaws of defeat. You the members have the power, the decision. I call on everyone now, to unite us, bring us together, and be the tribe we created. One of truth, honour and loyalty.
The infighting stops here. We must go to those who have left us, talk to them, unite ourselves. I do not see my role as duke as one of power and decision making. I see my role now as reconciler. Together I want us to reunite this tribe. Once that is done, discussion and voting for who our leadership is will begin.
This is not a power grab; this is a desperate attempt to save our tribe.
But who decides whether we live or die, is not me, but you.
Sincerely
Mark ([player]WarpedThunder[/player])
EXP, we are on the brink of ruin. Internal disputes between leaders have gone on for months. Our enemies close in on us, and our old allies join them. Our once great empire had resorted onto infighting and power struggles. The first of our fallout was [ally]F.P.B[/ally]. A struggle between [player]Vikki Venom[/player] and [player]Doozy[/player] for tribe leadership. The fallout from that dispute has hurt us much. Still more leave us, dissatisfied with the fractured [ally]EXP[/ally].
Yesterday, myself and a number of others on the council thought it best, that the solution to this, was for us to take charge so that we can unite the tribe and bring back F.P.B into the fold. To make our tribe great again. But I see we were wrong. I was wrong. What was meant to be a way of saving us, has only threatened to split us more. At this point, as many of you know, [player]Vikki Venom[/player] seeks to make a new tribe. To split away from the tribe and start a fresh. It hurts to know that I have caused this, as I only ever took actions that were to be for the best of the tribe.
But it is not me, nor Vikki, nor Doozy who will solve these problems of ours. It is you. So caught up have we been in an eternal power struggle, we have forgotten who really controls a tribe, forgotten who we are. The last thing I want is to split this tribe up more. All I want is to unite it. But I cannot do that alone. You the members have to grasp the impossible from the jaws of defeat. You the members have the power, the decision. I call on everyone now, to unite us, bring us together, and be the tribe we created. One of truth, honour and loyalty.
The infighting stops here. We must go to those who have left us, talk to them, unite ourselves. I do not see my role as duke as one of power and decision making. I see my role now as reconciler. Together I want us to reunite this tribe. Once that is done, discussion and voting for who our leadership is will begin.
This is not a power grab; this is a desperate attempt to save our tribe.
But who decides whether we live or die, is not me, but you.
Sincerely
Mark ([player]WarpedThunder[/player])
As you can see, the tone is largely apologetic in the middle. The strategy being to mild the situation, and stop any split, with talks with Vikki.
However, unfortunately due to Warped being away for a while, Vikki sent this mail just a few minutes before also:
I spoke to vikki once again, telling her to look at the tone and content of what Warped had written. The conversation is below:
[28/04/2010 14:39:25] Rob: powerful circular
[28/04/2010 14:40:13] Vikki Venom: i have ppl wanting invites already
[28/04/2010 14:40:42] Rob: though his circular
[28/04/2010 14:40:48] Rob: is also
[28/04/2010 14:40:49] Rob: very good
[28/04/2010 14:41:05] Vikki Venom: mine has the proof on it though
[28/04/2010 14:41:12] Rob: his does not need proof
[28/04/2010 14:41:15] Rob: he makes no claims...
[28/04/2010 14:41:20] Rob: thats a silly comment to make :S
[28/04/2010 14:50:54] Rob: once you split it will be very hard to go back
[28/04/2010 14:51:16] Vikki Venom: there is no going back
[28/04/2010 14:51:26] Rob: right now not everything is lost
[28/04/2010 14:51:55] Rob: warpedthunder appears to be
[28/04/2010 14:51:56] Rob: quite humble
[28/04/2010 14:52:36] Vikki Venom: yes he realised he fucked up!
[28/04/2010 14:52:55] Rob: and you will not accept that and try to move forward for the best of exp?
[28/04/2010 14:53:07] Rob: how things were done was not the right way of doing things
[28/04/2010 14:53:09] Rob: we both know that
[28/04/2010 14:53:18] Rob: but if they accept that, do we still throw a paddy if they apologise for it
[28/04/2010 14:55:29] Rob: you once said "I had always stated i would duke EXP until a better duke is found or Horsychen himself returns."
I am not saying that anyone is better than you or not, but it does seem you are feeling hurt for what happened, and not thinking clearly. You wanted to do what was best for EXP before. It can still be that now
[28/04/2010 14:40:13] Vikki Venom:
i have ppl wanting invites already[28/04/2010 14:40:42] Rob: though his circular
[28/04/2010 14:40:48] Rob: is also
[28/04/2010 14:40:49] Rob: very good
[28/04/2010 14:41:05] Vikki Venom: mine has the proof on it though
[28/04/2010 14:41:12] Rob: his does not need proof
[28/04/2010 14:41:15] Rob: he makes no claims...
[28/04/2010 14:41:20] Rob: thats a silly comment to make :S
[28/04/2010 14:50:54] Rob: once you split it will be very hard to go back
[28/04/2010 14:51:16] Vikki Venom: there is no going back
[28/04/2010 14:51:26] Rob: right now not everything is lost
[28/04/2010 14:51:55] Rob: warpedthunder appears to be
[28/04/2010 14:51:56] Rob: quite humble
[28/04/2010 14:52:36] Vikki Venom: yes he realised he fucked up!
[28/04/2010 14:52:55] Rob: and you will not accept that and try to move forward for the best of exp?
[28/04/2010 14:53:07] Rob: how things were done was not the right way of doing things
[28/04/2010 14:53:09] Rob: we both know that
[28/04/2010 14:53:18] Rob: but if they accept that, do we still throw a paddy if they apologise for it
[28/04/2010 14:55:29] Rob: you once said "I had always stated i would duke EXP until a better duke is found or Horsychen himself returns."
I am not saying that anyone is better than you or not, but it does seem you are feeling hurt for what happened, and not thinking clearly. You wanted to do what was best for EXP before. It can still be that now
She did not respond after that. Still annoyed and angry, she split off the tribe, taking what she could with her. I asked her to join again, teling her a vote would be won by her. Each time she refused, now in love with her own creation. This can be illustrated below. It also shows something I was quite disgusted by.
[28/04/2010 21:41:39] Vikki Venom: hiya
[28/04/2010 21:41:51] Rob: sorry havent joined
[28/04/2010 21:42:02] Rob: like a couple of others, wanted to stay behind to get ur arse back over here in leadership
[28/04/2010 21:42:22] Vikki Venom: they don't want me in leadership though
[28/04/2010 21:42:33] Vikki Venom: the tribe has proved beyond doubt they do
[28/04/2010 21:42:34] Rob: and if they then do?
[28/04/2010 21:42:36] Rob: if the tribe
[28/04/2010 21:42:38] Rob: get a vote
[28/04/2010 21:42:40] Rob: and say yes to you?
[28/04/2010 21:43:57] Vikki Venom: i'm here now and everyone is happy
[28/04/2010 21:44:14] Rob: are they?
[28/04/2010 21:44:16] Rob: is exp happy
[28/04/2010 21:44:19] Rob: the ones who dont know whats happened
[28/04/2010 21:44:23] Rob: who odnt understand
[28/04/2010 21:44:24] Vikki Venom: fire is
[28/04/2010 21:44:27] Rob: who just want EXP united?
[28/04/2010 21:44:35] Vikki Venom: my mail should have said it all
[28/04/2010 21:44:36] Rob: and all those players not in FIRE but still want u here?
[28/04/2010 21:44:56] Rob: FIRE players will still be taken out by W1N
[28/04/2010 21:44:59] Rob: it will be even easier
[28/04/2010 21:46:22] Vikki Venom: ppl are still moving over...
[28/04/2010 21:46:28] Vikki Venom: i have mails unanswered
[28/04/2010 21:46:33] Vikki Venom: on here and ingame..
[28/04/2010 21:49:26] Rob: yes
[28/04/2010 21:49:29] Rob: doesnt mean u shud come back
[28/04/2010 21:49:49] Rob: would chen want this
[28/04/2010 21:50:26] Vikki Venom: would have wanted to see me stabbed in the back no
[28/04/2010 21:50:38] Vikki Venom: but at least i will look after anyone that wants to come
[28/04/2010 21:50:47] Vikki Venom: i'mm only sending out invites on request
[28/04/2010 21:50:47] Rob: u cant look after those here?
[28/04/2010 21:50:57] Vikki Venom: ppl are disgusted with what happened last night
[28/04/2010 21:51:18] Vikki Venom: and tbh
[28/04/2010 21:51:27] Vikki Venom: i want ppl i can trust and who trust me
[28/04/2010 21:55:15] Rob: is that really best
[28/04/2010 21:55:23] Rob: does it have to be about what you want?
[28/04/2010 21:41:51] Rob: sorry havent joined
[28/04/2010 21:42:02] Rob: like a couple of others, wanted to stay behind to get ur arse back over here in leadership
[28/04/2010 21:42:22] Vikki Venom: they don't want me in leadership though
[28/04/2010 21:42:33] Vikki Venom: the tribe has proved beyond doubt they do
[28/04/2010 21:42:34] Rob: and if they then do?
[28/04/2010 21:42:36] Rob: if the tribe
[28/04/2010 21:42:38] Rob: get a vote
[28/04/2010 21:42:40] Rob: and say yes to you?
[28/04/2010 21:43:57] Vikki Venom: i'm here now and everyone is happy
[28/04/2010 21:44:14] Rob: are they?
[28/04/2010 21:44:16] Rob: is exp happy
[28/04/2010 21:44:19] Rob: the ones who dont know whats happened
[28/04/2010 21:44:23] Rob: who odnt understand
[28/04/2010 21:44:24] Vikki Venom: fire is
[28/04/2010 21:44:27] Rob: who just want EXP united?
[28/04/2010 21:44:35] Vikki Venom: my mail should have said it all
[28/04/2010 21:44:36] Rob: and all those players not in FIRE but still want u here?
[28/04/2010 21:44:56] Rob: FIRE players will still be taken out by W1N
[28/04/2010 21:44:59] Rob: it will be even easier
[28/04/2010 21:46:22] Vikki Venom: ppl are still moving over...
[28/04/2010 21:46:28] Vikki Venom: i have mails unanswered
[28/04/2010 21:46:33] Vikki Venom: on here and ingame..
[28/04/2010 21:49:26] Rob: yes
[28/04/2010 21:49:29] Rob: doesnt mean u shud come back
[28/04/2010 21:49:49] Rob: would chen want this
[28/04/2010 21:50:26] Vikki Venom: would have wanted to see me stabbed in the back no
[28/04/2010 21:50:38] Vikki Venom: but at least i will look after anyone that wants to come
[28/04/2010 21:50:47] Vikki Venom: i'mm only sending out invites on request
[28/04/2010 21:50:47] Rob: u cant look after those here?
[28/04/2010 21:50:57] Vikki Venom: ppl are disgusted with what happened last night
[28/04/2010 21:51:18] Vikki Venom: and tbh
[28/04/2010 21:51:27] Vikki Venom: i want ppl i can trust and who trust me
[28/04/2010 21:55:15] Rob: is that really best
[28/04/2010 21:55:23] Rob: does it have to be about what you want?
You may have not seen it, since I am sure many gloss over it. But to emphasize with what was said on a EXP chat by a Vikki supporter:
[28/04/2010 22:36:17] buchaillog: She was told that she would be better off away from the stress of the council no one wanted her to leave the tribe
[28/04/2010 22:36:31] IncomingIain: so if your tribe doesnt want you, do you take everyone you can to form a new tribe at detriment of your old tribe?
[28/04/2010 22:36:42] buchaillog: not in my book
[28/04/2010 22:36:47] IncomingIain: not in mine either
[28/04/2010 22:36:48] john15051985: anyone she has taken has mailed her and asked
[28/04/2010 22:36:31] IncomingIain: so if your tribe doesnt want you, do you take everyone you can to form a new tribe at detriment of your old tribe?
[28/04/2010 22:36:42] buchaillog: not in my book
[28/04/2010 22:36:47] IncomingIain: not in mine either
[28/04/2010 22:36:48] john15051985: anyone she has taken has mailed her and asked
A claim that Vikki had only been mailed, did not mail anyone. A claim Vikki made to me in the skype convo above when she said "i'mm only sending out invites on request". However, this is totally disproved in the same conversation, where she asked me to join and said she had 20 already confirmed. It's an incredible lie. One that was made to make it look like she did not have to rally for support. With no major opposition it was an easy lie to get away with, but a hugely destructive one. She did not leave and have some people go hey can I join you in that one personed ambitionless tribe, rather she wanted revenge, a mark of her own.
Though this is not a rant at Vikki. But I think the conversations above can show you that it was quite remarkable what happened. I have misplaced the mail, but it is in very similar terms to the Doozy leaving and making FPB that she rallied against. He declared on CHE!!! in a circular, claiming it his last act as leader. Destructive and irrisponsible. A move that damaged EXP a huge amount. Vikki had now done a very similar action, also damaging the tribe.
I was reminded of the comparatively subtle argument with Adellion on the other thread about the merits of following loyalty and of thinking for yourself. But this had hit a whole new chapter. These leaders believed they deserved loyalty. I kept thinking the same question.
When did leaders start believing they were there to be served instead of knowing they were there to serve??
The EXP account I had, had no support, and although Vikki assured me that it was because it had just come out of bunnies, I still wondered why it didn't have support before that. Whilst others said this was not uncommon. (Edit: Evidence has been given to this, but sensitive information means editing it out).
From the start, EXP had no organisation, co-ordination was useless, with the only thing I saw was bragging about old co-ordination.
[27/04/2010 23:41:49] Rob: your forum and way of co-ordinating is pretty messy
[27/04/2010 23:42:10] Vikki Venom: u not seen one of my co ords lol
[27/04/2010 23:42:19] Vikki Venom: i haven't co orded since january
[27/04/2010 23:42:30] Rob: as in general co-ord
[27/04/2010 23:42:35] Vikki Venom: last one took 50 vills in 2 days and killed RES in a week
[27/04/2010 23:42:37] Vikki Venom: LOL
[27/04/2010 23:42:10] Vikki Venom: u not seen one of my co ords lol
[27/04/2010 23:42:19] Vikki Venom: i haven't co orded since january
[27/04/2010 23:42:30] Rob: as in general co-ord
[27/04/2010 23:42:35] Vikki Venom: last one took 50 vills in 2 days and killed RES in a week
[27/04/2010 23:42:37] Vikki Venom: LOL
But onto now on the next part of the story. Players were leaving all over the place. FIRE gained a huge amount, and some went to FPB. EXP was in complete disarray and Warped knew that whatever it was they had planned, it had failed, totally failed. By now Warped had made me baron, so that I could clear a few areas of the forum up, which was a complete mess, so that I could start clamping down on the hate talk, and clear up a few loose ends :icon_wink: One idea that had quickly gained momentum was that an election should be held. For the tribe to decide who should lead next. However, things were looking like there wouldn't even be enough time. I told Warped finally who my old account was, and told him to make me interim Duke whilst elections went on. To steer the boat through the storm. Warped convinced the council to make me duke, and so it was, me, Iain666, was duke :icon_wink:
I got to work, clearing things up, talking to other tribes, and making sure to talk to enough, get some reassurances on temporarily staying, to get enough support for people to stay long enough. I started bringing EXT into EXP to beefen up the numbers, since there was now space enough for just one tribe also.
Talks with other tribes were mostly uninteresting. Fire were being stubborn, Doozy was being communicative in respect to helping us co-ordinating, effectively trying to help each other, but ruling any possibility out of returning, despite Vikki having left. He also seemingly had grown attached to his new tribe. Interesting phsycological lessons for any who are keen enough to spot them.
However, there was quite some talk with T4H that was amusing. First of all, the original talks that led to T4H vs. EXP.
Now, having been given the talks that led to EXP vs T4H, I can say the actions of anyone even in the council of EXP should be questioned. This was such an abusive, aggressive, and reckless move by them to take in TEA. I do not know who was the main driving force behind it, but critisize anyone who stood for it I must. Yet more leadership failings in EXP.
But the T4H talks... well I can say unless they change tune any time soon T4H and EXP are staying at war for some time. But what must be noted was the power grab at which T4H tried to reach. They offered a merge of the whole of EXP. Telling them they could move into the 4 tribes of T4H. That FW would stop the war, with some inactives compensation, and that W1N would stop using the friendship they had with them and the inactive compensation, added to active players giving 5-10 villages each. Leading to this glorious quote:
T4H as a tribe, seem oblivious of anything to do with W1N. They even believe they are in more control than W1N are of negotiations by the sounds of things. Is quite incredible. When did merge wars start becoming common practice on this world? When did leaders start only looking out for themselves?
And so we come to the end of this story. There are tiny details I have left out, but the majority of the story is here. The vote in EXP went onto be a one horse race, as the new leader made an excellent speech, which no-one else opposed with their own.
Whilst for myself, maybe it's time for something new :icon_wink: I also have a W47 tribe I really should be leading right now... :icon_wink: But I shall end with a few summary points:
- Yes this did happen in under a week. Yes I did become EXP leader, the at the time rank 2 tribe, in just two days. Thank you for those who have managed to call me amazing, God, a master of subterfuge (cheers Timmy :icon_wink
and tell me I suck all within around 3 days. Though really, I didn't actually write this for myself, but for those in EXP. So no comments on that.- There were remarkable failings by the old EXP leadership. Both Doozy and Vikki seemed to lead for themselves. They both had less regard for the actual players in EXP, and the players in EXP have been very hard done by.
- Some players in EXP should be commended for their loyalty and efforts. Instead, they are rewarded with downward looks, jibes and their old leaders who have done them wrong getting away with it. On other threads some of these leaders even look like angels. This is wrong.
- T4H offered to merge EXP. An interesting development. Whilst T4H seemed badly led and disorganised.
- EXP is still very much active, with a new elected duke.
- What will happen? It is likely Fire will fall at some point. At the moment it will continue to do very well in its honey moon period. EXP will likely go on for a while, but unfortunately, despite some players actions being commendable, I believe they will stumble. F.P.B, however, I believe will go from strength to strength. Critical I have been of Doozy in this thread, and he does have large flaws. But he is a strong leader with a steady grip on things from what has been seen. I can see F.P.B becoming a light version of EXP/EXT. Though ultimately, the role they will have on this world will be small. The centerpiece of the world that is W1N, will likely not see any threat for some time from this side of the world, leaving TR, Flux and Orc the main components in a possible world war against W1N. Though what any of these tribe's status' are are largely speculative.
Hope you enjoyed the read :icon_wink:
Bye bye
Blue :icon_wink:
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